First Timer

wagra dexters · Post by **wagra dexters** » Sat Nov 01, 2008 10:08 am

No Rob H, it isn't guaranteed at all, unfortunately.

At the risk of being boringly repetitve, but for the benefit of any possible new people just tuned in to Dexters, mixing short & long doesn't make medium like yellow & red make orange. Mixing short & long makes short or long.

'Short', dwarf chondrodysplasia carriers, hide true height. They may look small and gorgeous, but they don't always re-produce small and gorgeous.
'Long', non-carriers, can be any height within the Dexter range but what you see is what you get when joined to another similar non-carrier.

'Medium' is just a terminology for the non-carrier who is at the lower and often chunkier end of the 'long-leg' Dexter scale.

The only way to breed medium Dexters is to use medium non-carrier sires and dams, or to breed medium non-carrier stock to other stock, long 'long' or 'short' carriers and select the offspring for type, ensuring that they are medium rather than carriers by DNA testing where relevant.

Margaret.

Duncan MacIntyre · Post by **Duncan MacIntyre** » Sat Nov 01, 2008 10:34 am

Well put Margaret, the other misconception I find croping up is the idea that it matters if there are carriers in the previous generation when selecting non-carriers. If a Dexter has not inherited the bulldog gene from one of its parents then it cannot pass it on. Probably better to test all the offspring of carriers just to be sure, that is what I did with all my 1st generation non-carriers out of shorts, several of whom had produced bulldogs. But once a non carrier always a non-carrier - it will not reappear in later generations if you have already eliminated it.

Duncan

Broomcroft · Post by **Broomcroft** » Sat Nov 01, 2008 11:10 am

Isn't there a booklet/leaflet available for new dexter keepers to help them understand about short and long. Not one with a sway on it; just something that gives them the facts so they don't go in the wrong direction which I did when I started, for 2 years.

How about someone write one up, if there's nothing suitable available, and get it posted on the web as a download. Something easy to read and understand. Every time I meet a new owner and tell how longs can be short, and shorts breed longs half the time, they have the same expression on their faces as I did 5 years ago.

Edited By Broomcroft on 1225534334

monica waltho · Post by **monica waltho** » Sat Nov 01, 2008 11:01 pm

good idea Clive, and anyone joining the society or making enquirys on the breed should get a copy, perhaps have leaflets available on the breed stand at shows.

tooloos · Post by **tooloos** » Sat Nov 01, 2008 11:12 pm

should have taken my father in laws advice and bought pigs ! :laugh:

wagra dexters · Post by **wagra dexters** » Sat Nov 01, 2008 11:18 pm

Dexters are much better. You will never rue the day.
Margaret.

Broomcroft · Post by **Broomcroft** » Sun Nov 02, 2008 9:55 am

If you're doing your own beef Tooloos, just give some to your father in law and he'll say he how glad he is that you didn't go for pigs.

welshdexterboy · Post by **welshdexterboy** » Mon Nov 03, 2008 12:31 am

Tooloos why don't you have both :D I have just had some lovely pork for supper from one of our pigs and it tastes so much more than the rubbish in the shops. If you have the space that is if not you will need the grass for the cows.

Your suggestion Clive is as I have come to expect a very good one. When I was told about long and short and then mediums cropped up I thought :p What am I doing with these???

Keep the type you like (s-l-m) or just keep them all cos at the end of the day the beef is the best from all sizes :D

Inger · Post by **Inger** » Thu Nov 20, 2008 12:12 pm

We've got both Dexters and Devon Black Pigs. Great combination.

I have a suggestion for you, regarding this whole Chodrodysplasia issue. See if you can get rid of the whole leg length labelling completely and just use carrier and non-carrier. Its so much easier. Then all the new owner needs to know is 'is my cow a carrier or not' if yes, then only use a non-carrier bull. If not, then any bull is possible.

If people are interested in breeding shorter Dexters, then they simply ask the height of the non-carrier bull at the hips and if it meets the required height of the hirer, its a goer. The average height of a non-carrier's family (all non-carrier relatives that is), will tell you what to expect when you use that bull over your cow. If your cow is taller than average, use a bull from a herd that has shorter non-carriers and your next generation will be shorter than the cow. Keep repeating the process over generations and your whole non-carrier herd will be shorter than you started with. Using carrier bulls won't bring your herd height average down. It will just give you two herds. One lot will be short carriers and the other lot can often be tall non-carriers. All from the same bull. I've seen it myself.

Our short chunky carrier bull throws taller non-carrier calves, than our taller non-carrier bull, who consistantly throws 26 inch high calves on average at birth.

We also have a short non-carrier bull that consistantly throws small calves, when crossed with our non-carrier cows of varying heights. Its the height of the non-carrier parents that decides the height of the offspring and their calves will always turn out non-carriers of a similiar height. Carriers offspring on the other hand, are a lucky dip.

You've understood the carrier to non-carrier bit though tooloos. That's a good start. :laugh: I wish that everyone I knew, understood that simple fact, but I'm still coming across people willing to risk the safety of their cows by mating known carriers to carriers. That upsets me.

Edited By Inger on 1227179796

Inger · Post by **Inger** » Thu Nov 20, 2008 12:23 pm

The software won't let me edit my own post. So I'll add here, that the short non-carrier bull I mentioned in my previous post, is 43 inches at hip height at the age of 2 years. He comes from a family of non-carriers that fit within the breed height standard and they have, over the years, consistantly won Champion ribbons at numerous Cattle Shows in NZ.

Edited By Inger on 1227180476