Breeding Bulls

LewisMoore · Post by **LewisMoore** » Wed Jun 04, 2008 8:30 pm

i will try and get some more recent photo on for you, see what you think of him

thanks again

natmadaboutdexters · Post by **natmadaboutdexters** » Thu Jun 05, 2008 10:24 am

Hi Lewis,

For showing bulls over 1 year old they have to have a nose ring. Our vet came and did ours at just over a year old and he was fine. We had halter trained him since a young age but he was beginning to be a bit more lively. Once he had the nose ring , we had total control again when leading him and he walks very well. In fact he went to his first show last month and behaved impeccably.

Saffy, your young bull looks just like an 8 month old we have at the moment!

Personally, keeping two bulls is a real pain as I don't want to run them together and only have limited grazing, hence the young bull is still in the barn, where he will remain until I sell him. We only have 14 Dexters and I will probably steer all future bull calves.

Natasha Lewis

LewisMoore · Post by **LewisMoore** » Thu Jun 05, 2008 11:11 am

These were taken this morning, what do you think of him.

How do you resize the image so it fits on the screen?

lewis

Edited By LewisMoore on 1212661023

Saffy · Post by **Saffy** » Thu Jun 05, 2008 12:19 pm

Hello Lewis,

A couple of good photographs there.

I am always pleased to see a pic, it is nice to have a look at other peoples Dexters.

Your little bull is in excellent condition, so his Mum must be milking well.

I have to admit I am no expert on resizing the pics Lewis. There are a couple of ways that I know of one is by croppng them on something like Picasa, the other is with Photoshop which I have just recieved an ancient copy of and am trying to get used to. You can so I am told use the crop tool and tell it how many pixels you want or cms or inches. So far I just crop them down as much as possible in picasa especially on the width, so they fit these pages a bit better. ???

Stephanie

Rutherford · Post by **Rutherford** » Thu Jun 05, 2008 1:08 pm

Thanks for the pics. Lewis, he looks very well. Could we have one of his mum, it would be good to see what she looks like since he is going to pass her genes, judging by the look of him, she is a pretty good milker.
Beryl (Woodmagic)

Broomcroft · Post by **Broomcroft** » Thu Jun 05, 2008 3:34 pm

Lewis - From my point of view, beef, Steely Dan 3 (the smaller photo) looks best as far as it's possible to tell, but from a show point of view, I have no idea at all. He looks slightly more male, deeper chested etc to me, but photographs can be deceptive. You also need to consider their personalities. A calm, nice quiet bull is good, who isn't nervous. But you don't want an animal with no get up and go either.

Edited By Broomcroft on 1212687692

Rutherford · Post by **Rutherford** » Thu Jun 05, 2008 5:10 pm

I will leave others to advise on his showing prospects. As for as how he can be expected to breed, you need to look at his dam and his sire’s dam. As Clive remarked once, you can look on the bull as the postman of his two nearest female’s genes. Check them over and you know what he can pass on. That is why I asked whether we could see a picture of his dam, although looks are only a bit of the inheritance. Things like beef, temperament, milk and butterfat production will all come from those two dams. Looking at pedigrees can only tell you what he might inherit, but he has to collect everything through those two cows. Recessives complicate things somewhat, and if you can see other close relatives you may see something that they carry but doesn’t show up in them. Breeding can never be certain, except where a DNA test is available for that particular gene. It is worth remembering most recessive genes are the deleterious ones.
Beryl (Woodmagic)

LewisMoore · Post by **LewisMoore** » Thu Jun 05, 2008 9:08 pm

This is Clearview Clover, we puchased her with then intention to produce milk for the house, she thought otherwise! These aren't the best pitures i will try and get you some more recent photographs.

Lewis

Saffy · Post by **Saffy** » Fri Jun 06, 2008 3:11 pm

Hi Lewis,

A pic taken straight on would be good if at all possible, as it makes it easier to see if an animal has a straight top line.

Clover hasn't got the tidiest of udders and teats, which would put me off keeping a bull from her, as I would assume that he would throw me heifers with similar traits.

However that doesn't necessarily mean that you can't keep a bull from her because she is your cow not mine and you are attempting to breed your herd, to please your eye, not mine! :;):

Stephanie

redhill · Post by **redhill** » Fri Jun 06, 2008 3:31 pm

Hello Lewis As Saffy says not the tidiest of udders, but what a wonderful under carriage for hand milking, it's a shame she doesnt agree! perhaps next time she calves you could try taking some milk from one side whilst the calf is feeding on the other, that and a bucket with some Sugar beet pellets might just win her over. Sue Castlemears Dexters

LewisMoore · Post by **LewisMoore** » Sat Jun 07, 2008 11:58 am

Hello all,
These pics were taken this morning i hope they give you a beter look at the cow.

Above is steely dan today.
Below is my other cows udder (her bull calf is in the background), is this more what you would call a tidy udder?

I have also been asked to tell you about Clover (dun cow above) when we reared a simmintal bull calf off of her aswell as her own calf (steered) as there was far too much milk for him.
Originally we wanted to milk clover for the house but she wouldn't have it, my dad was also getting fed up of being knocked about. The simmintal didn't give up as easily and although the occasional kick he managed to suckle after a few weeks with no bother at all. It was as easy as slipping the halter on the cow tieing her up and bringing in the calf (the hard part was trying to get him back out). I understand some people haven't had a lot of success rearing another calf but if the calf is game then with a bit of persistance you should be getting somewhere.

Lewis

Saffy · Post by **Saffy** » Sat Jun 07, 2008 2:17 pm

Thanks Lewis,

Both for the pics and the info on your double suckling experiences. I have heard more than once, that Dexters aren't too keen on being given an extra calf, so I think you have done rather well there.

How long did she rear it for?

Stephanie

wagra · Post by **wagra** » Sat Jun 07, 2008 2:30 pm

Lewis, I wouldn't want to dampen your enthusiasm, but as well as a poor udder, do you really want a paddock full of cows with feet like hers? I can see that the ground looks soft, but her problems are further up, weaknesses which will not go away with hoof trimming.

Old photos and hand drawings all depict Dexters with overly long feet, weak pasterns and no heel, but just because Dexters have been bred with no attention to those faults in the past doesn't make them sound or acceptable.

You are at the beginning of your herd establishment, an ideal place to start getting your eye in, working out the strengths & weaknesses. It would be better to find a bull from a family without the same faults.

These criticisms are not about cows looking pretty, they are about potential breakdowns of your future breeders, their udders and their feet, long before their use-by dates are due.

Edited By wagra on 1212845554

LewisMoore · Post by **LewisMoore** » Sat Jun 07, 2008 3:25 pm

What do you suggest i do then? i would apprecieate some advice.
Lewis

natmadaboutdexters · Post by **natmadaboutdexters** » Sat Jun 07, 2008 4:15 pm

I would at least get their feet trimmed as it should improve the way that they stand, in that they will not be standing on the back of their heels and should start standing on their toes again. We used to rear friesian bulls and sometimes their feet got long like your Dexters but once trimmed they did walk properly again.

I'm not saying that it is the answer in your case but I would give it a try. As for udders, looking at the showing handbook the teat have to be of equal length and all hang at the same height.

Natasha