Elite Bull Scheme - Does no one care!

[Broomcroft]

That's my situation as well. I stick to beef and leave choosing a bull to someone who has a record of doing it well.

As a note, I think there is a danger that people will assume that Elite bulls are good for beef which is not necessarily the case I feel. Maybe the scheme ought to have qualifications, i.e. this bull seems to be good at producing beefy offspring, or whatever.

I think the scheme is a good idea, but it does need marketing and making more meaningful somehow.

I've tried to find a list of Elite bulls to no avail. The Society are going to get one for me. This shouldn't be necessary really. It would be best posted somewhere, on the site, or in a bulletin would it not?

[Woodmagic]

I cited my own early experience because I think it illustrates the dilemma. At that time, I was the apparent ignorant novice. The ‘experts’ were promoting the short leg bull, today we know that such an animal carries a lethal recessive which can give the appearance of a beefy animal, although it is actually hiding what would be discarded by any self respecting Dexter breeder, if they could actually see what they were breeding. Who is going to decide who can reliably be left to breed their own thing, who decides on the ‘experts’?
I suggest the reason that the Cardiff project has found such a wealth of diversity, is probably due to the many small herds that have retained a bull, and before that to nature. As Kirk U.S. points out : Nature has a way of sorting this out. Even if the awkward looking animal with excellent genes has fewer offspring (due to not being selected as a mate by as many females), his progeny and descendants may have better survivability than the more numerous offspring of the good looking animal with some poor genetics.
It would be pity if we set out to negate the excellent historic breeding we have inherited.
If breeding could be done by picking good-looking bulls, we should have a national herd of champions by now, no breed is more show conscious. I wish it were that easy.
I am more interested in performance, whether milk or beef. I want to enjoy looking at my cattle, but I keep my bulls to breed stock that will perform well.

[Broomcroft]

Woodmagic - I think you are saying, don't meddle too much, and you are so right.

[Inger]

No, I think Woodmagic is saying that breeding good animals is more than picking the prettiest animals. There is the performance of their parents, grandparents, uncles, aunts and cousins. The family line with few duds turning up, could be reasonably assumed to contain mostly good genes. Other wise more duds would have appeared in the family lineup.

So the lesson is, look at as many extended family members of a bull's family, as possible, before making your choice of a new bull. Look for the family line that has the attributes you need to improve your female line. Pick out the faults in your cow herd and seek a bull with strengths in that area, so that the next generation has more chance of having those faults corrected.

Each breeder must look for the type of bull that best suits their needs. This generally means that each breeder is looking for something slightly different in a bull. Whatever they are looking for, the bull should be sound in all the basic areas of conformation and foot soundness.

[Broomcroft]

Hi Inger - Appreciate and agree with what you have said. That is how I choose a bull. Because any bull I used would go on a lot of cows, I would not buy a bull at all unless I could see loads of progeny as well as his breeding. My current bull was a hire bull, so he had loads of history. I will be looking for a new bull this year.

[happy hollidays]

To be successful you need quality both bulls and cows. But I see a big hinderence - people like me! Smallholders who just want to tick over with a few cattle, like to think wev'e done right buy getting a cow with a green paper, but does it really matter to us deep down, I think not. I would not pay big money as I only want to breed to eat on a personal basis and I'm quite sure there are many like minded out there. Lets face it, programs such as river cottage has introduced the Dexter into many homes as the perfect cow for the smallholder. Usually there is a small budget and equally small acreage and that I see is your achiles heal. A two tear system should work as long as people are realistic, practical and honest. It is essential to have the "elite" in this breed.

[Inger]

Very true Happy Holidays. I feel that the Dexter breed can be all things to all people. A show animal, a house cow, a pet, a grass mower and the provider of a calf to grow for the freezer. Yes there needs to be room for everyone's requirements. That's where our graded up cattle come to the fore in NZ. It means that everyone can afford to own some kind of Dexter. The serious breeders stick to their 'purebloods' without any grading up in their pedigree and the new smallholders are happy to buy the lower grades, according to their finances. Each can have the kind of Dexter they want for their needs. Then there are others like me, who start with what we can afford and breed up, to what we hope is a respectable example of a purebred Dexter. :laugh: