Herd Book - Herd Book 2005

[Ted Neal]

With all the discussion of pedigrees id has turned my thoughts to the Herd Book. It is my pleasure to have a look at this and try and produce a book that is both useful and can be lifted with one hand !!!
I would appreciate any comments as to what you regard as essential and what you think would be nice to have.
Do you want to know details of all the births in each herd and all animals owned at the end of the year. Bearing in mind that we never have a full response to the Herd Return
thanks gang

[Duncan MacIntyre]

Personally I much prefer the old style herdbook with a list of the cattle in each herd, and of all births, but I realise that as the numbers grow this becomes less possible for a variety of reasons, not only cost - the more members we have the more there will be who cannot or will not send in all the info, and the more info there is the more checking is needed to avoid mistakes. I suspect being realistic the way forward will be for electronic herd book - both for reference and for registrations. This should allow the more boring of us to sort info the way we want to look at it - Ped eView is OK as far as it goes but could be developed a lot more. And if it were the accepted means with printed versions on request only, then it would not be so expensive- it seems overpriced to me but then if there is small uptake the developers have to recoup their costs from far fewer sales. Basically these things are only interrelated databases in fancy dress. But as long as we are on printed herdbooks, the more info the better for me.

Duncan

[Ken Hobbs]

Duncan
Just to update you, Herd Books are at present produced on request plus a small percentage for new members. Life and Honorary members get thers free on request.
The cost of production for 2004 Herd Book was £3250 icome from sales was £3140 so it just about covers itself.
If we increase the size this will incurr further production cost. Hope this helps.

[Mark Bowles]

One thing i would like to see changed, why do they have to doctor the photos in the herdbook. It is so obvious and leads you to think exactly what has been touched up or rubbed out.
I know its difficult to get good photos, but we are only looking for 6 !!!!
I am also pretty sure it is not cheap to have someone enhance ( or not as the case may be) the photos, that money could be spent on some proper ones, im sure the owners of the cattle would share the costs in order to have a photo to treasure.
Mark

[groubearfarm]

My herd books are constantly in use but the format of the 2004 book has resulted in my previous ones getting even more use. Please put the herd returns back into the herd book. Quite honestly the costs when compared with other costs within the society, seem quite reasonable. Some things are worth more than just money, and when one looks back over so many years of herd books and all the history they contain, it seems a sad part of the twenty first century that things change for the sake of a few pence, especially as there is no electronic replacement which is available to ALL members. We will never have a full response to the herd book, just as some choose not to register their animals, however for those of us anoraks who are interested, please can we have the full monty! Fiona

[Ted Neal]

Keep the suggestions coming - it is most helpful. Whilst the A5 size would fit in with previous herd books, A4 may prove to be a more manageable and practical size. Your views are appreciated

[Duncan MacIntyre]

Don't mention the A4 size - what a nuisance it is having one year done in A4 in among all the others. Even though someeone has mentioned that computerised versions are not available to all I stil think that is the way forward and can present all the data in very flexible form. Once set up properly it can easily be added to each year and would be a wonderful tool for any of us interested in breeding. Once set up it would cost pence to produce copies.

Duncan

[Martin]

To be able to be printed on modern day presses, all this information must be in electronic format. So we must already have some years that could in theory be e'mailed to members, or sent on disk. If this happens Duncan, make sure you don't lose it amongst your A5 copies.
Electronic format may cause problems for those without a pc but for how long? I would imagine most people in this country have acces to a pc, even if they don't have one at home they could probably take a disk to someone to print a hard copy for them.
Maybe the Dexter Cattle Society should join the 21st century and start putting the herd book in electronic format, we will have to at some time! I would not expect to recieve back copies in this way, this could be an ongoing project that is done as and when the society could afford it ( we wouldn't want our fees going up would we? ).
For people that like researching their cattle ancestry, searching would be so much easier, tracing, in the event of problems would be quicker, transfers and births would be able to be seen as soon as they where entered into the database, wow, lets do it now!!!!

[Harriet Bunning]

I don't know if this would work but I think that all the herd books should be accessible over the internet.

[Kathy Millar]

All the breed societies I belong to put their registrations in both forms but none of them try to enumerate (right word?) each herd/flock every year. They just include that year's registrations, all previous registrations, member info etc. all searchable. Check out the one for the North American Shetland Sheep Breeders Association. So yes, please do set up an electronic herdbook!

And speaking of pedigrees, I wish the British ones would put the colour on them.

Kathy

[Woodmagic]

I can remember the avalanche of protests that descended upon us after the surfacing of the ‘91 A4, I still resent mine, at present balanced upon the rest. However if promotions could find us a miniature book case to store my old friends, with a deeper shelf to take the A4’s I would welcome it, if it meant it enabled the return of the old format with full details of herds, so that I had information of size of herd, bulls retained, was it largely composed of bought in animals, or well established, etc.
Corresponding with Australian breeders recently, I learnt that many of them now take hair from their calves when born, label and store it, as a precaution. Talking this over with a British breeder, it was suggested, that it might be an idea for a sample to be taken, and sent in with the yellow card. Within a comparatively short space of time, the Society would have samples of the majority of Dexters in this country. At eighteen months, the male samples could be destroyed, if they had not been registered
It could be argued that this gives the office extra work, but the Society is only as good as the identification of the cattle it is promoting, and as they years go by, DNA is likely to become more important. Whether we pay through direct costs to the Dutch company, or indirectly through our fees to the Society, this has to be the cheaper option. Bulls for AI would still need to be tested, and we would continue to encourage the test on a voluntary basis, but this would provide much more comprehensive cover. The Dexters sold outside of the Society, and their progeny would have their passport to confirm identity, and could return to the Society at any future date.

[Kathy Millar]

Could someone please tell me why the British pedigrees do not indicate animal colour? I would like to know who was red coloured in Saltaire Platinum's pedigree.

Kathy

[Woodmagic]

I am afraid Kathy, we were a bit slow to wake up on this one, the early Herd Books give no indication, but for a long period now, the colour has been shown by a letter in brackets after the name, ® or red and (D) for dun, otherwise it is black.