Dexter Cattle For Sale Discussion Board

There are a few members criticising the work of the D.C.S. council at present.
I believe thay are misguided and do not have the best interests at heart for the long term future of our breed.

Council members give freely of their time to run our society so I would like to remind you of the very positive things that they have achieved in the last few years.

Our beef scheme that goes far and beyond that of any other breed and gives our breed integrity and complete traceability. There are some wonderful posters released recently promoting Dexter beef.

Judges training to ensure we have competent judges for our cattle in the show ring. Remember showing is the shop window for our breed helping to promote sales for all of us.

Youth development programme for encouraging youngsters interests in the breed. They are our breeds future.

DNA testing and parent verification to guarantee the pedigrees of our cattle.

Linear Assessment to give us quantitative guidelines for better breeding.

A fantastic professionally run Genetics Symposium this year with prestigious speakers from home and abroad.

Just a few of the positive things that have happened. I am sure there are a lot more.

I have seen so much progress recently. Forty years ago I was collating 104 bulletins and stapling them together. Now we are sending out about 1,300 bulletins produced to a professional standard.

Our breed was laughed at by the livestock community then , look at it now, a main stream breed being run in a very professional manner. Thanks to all those hard working council members and sub-committee volunteers who have made it happen. Let them get on with it.

Off to open my shop now selling Dexter beef of course! I am so glad to have chosen the Dexter breed.

Di

You may believe that 'they' whoever 'they' are are misguided but the rest of the membership including myself has no information upon which to base a judgement.

I would like to see the Council Minutes re-instated to the membership and then perhaps we might all be more enlightened.

Three ex council members, one of whom is past Chairman of council, another is ex vice president (an office no longer used by DCS) and an honorary life member, have put their names to cricicism. But it is not possible to have a balanced discussion on this board as one of the three has been barred from posting on here. We badly need some open honest discussion, but that seems almost impossible to get. Those members we have email addresses for will almost certainly have had an email regarding this, and anyone reading this who wants to know more is welcome to email me at duncan.macintyre@btopenworld.com . My home phone number can be found in the herd book.

Di says "I believe thay are misguided and do not have the best interests at heart for the long term future of our breed." As a member, breeder, past vice president, former council member, former bull inspector, former field advisor, who has put heart and soul into my own Dexters and into the Dexter Cattle Society, I find this remark insulting in the extreme and an indication of the malaise that pervades our society these days. There is no need for it.

I too could list some positive things about the DCS, but it could and should all be so much better.

Duncan

I would suggest that it is precisely because they do have the long term future of the breed at heart that criticisms have been raised about lack of transparency with regard to Council.
A democracy should allow open debate and bringing issues into the open could motivate new blood to stand for election.
The concept of a genetics symposium is excellent and should be built upon. Dan Bradley's team in Dublin are world leaders in cattle genome studies and, for example, have identified introgression from indigenous aurochs into Dexters, Highland etc.
I'm sure all long term members of DCS have been quietly working for the good of the breed. My thesis is an example. We don't all want to be involved in the detail of running DCS but I would be quite happy to be co-opted if my specialist knowledge would be of value. We need information on any weaknesses in overall Council experience that could be addressed by relevant individuals in the membership.
We are not all primarily farmers or trying to make a living from our cattle, so some initiatives, such as Linear Assessment, may be of lesser interest to a portion of the membership.

I suggest that the three gentlemen who have raised their concerns & criticised the current council are well respected intelligent individuals and would not be voicing their opinions so vehemently without very good reason.

Yes the council members do give their services voluntarily & freely and we can pull some positives from the work done by them however this does not excuse the way they are currently operating in secret nor how members money is being spent without their knowledge.

Di suggest that forty years ago " Our breed was laughed at by the livestock community then , look at it now, a main stream breed being run in a very professional manner " - personally I think they are still laughing at our breed if not even more than then, Dexters are not by any means viewed as a main stream breed - what other main stream breed do you see selling yearlings at the local auction / market for £50 and cull cows making a few pence per kilo ?
Believe me they are still laughing every time they see a Dexter enter the auction ring and until we have a more professional council who are actually actively pushing the breed forward commercially this is the way it will remain.

It appears that there have been some goings on within council which definitely should not be occurring, which is quite possibly why there is such a lack of transparency and I therefore agree wholeheartedly with the criticisms which have been raised & will be offering my support to the intended motion and feel that any others who have the future of the breed in mind should do the same !

Over the last two decades I've experienced less 'laughing' and we've also had a changing breed society, but to say that one has caused the other is rather wishful thinking. Also prices and whether people laugh at the breed are two separate things.

Dexters have a reputation as;

a) hobby farmers cows
b) short-term farmers cows

and to be fair, that reputation is well deserved.

Some people still laugh when you say that you have Dexters because they're expecting you to say that you have four called Dolly, Molly Polly & Jess and for you to demonstrate how little you know about cattle. They're not laughing at the breed but at the people who (they think) keep the breed.

I visited a local farmer who I didn't know from Adam a few years ago and it was the first time I gained instant respect when I said we had Dexters. We'd seen that he'd erected a roundhouse so we went for a look & after asking what breed of cattle we had our apologetic response was met with 'there's nothing wrong with Dexters'. I was suprised to say the least.

Breed societies all have politics going on behind the scenes that threaten their future, it has nothing to do with the breed as even the most commercial livestock breeds have been there. It usually requires someone with a real passion for both the breed and managing people to bang some heads together and take it forward with a clear and honest objective.

Rob R wrote: Breed societies all have politics going on behind the scenes that threaten their future, it has nothing to do with the breed as even the most commercial livestock breeds have been there. It usually requires someone with a real passion for both the breed and managing people to bang some heads together and take it forward with a clear and honest objective.

Rob I agree 100% with your comment here, so lets hope that the proposed resolution by Alan Carrington, Duncan Macintyre & Ian Simpson gets the support of members and the Society will have the opportunity to have some new faces council !

Yep, I hope they are sucessful.

As for people laughing at Dexters, this is the reason why.

B****r the farmers and their opinions. The people who matter are the ones the farmers are selling to - the abattoirs, the butchers, the final consumer and nothing is going to move forward until these people are targeted.

All anyone is interested in is farming Dexter owners. There is no outlet and that is what is going to make farmers take the breed more seriously because the above want to buy them.

As joint proposer to the resolution to remove members of Council I feel entitled to reply to comments

Di claims we are criticising Council. In my opinion this is a poor choice of words.
We are highlighting a problem which has been ongoing or many months when Council have failed or refused to answer legitimate questions raised by members. All attempts to resolve this situation including refusal by Council to pursue mediation have failed.
This resolution to remove Directors provides allows members of the Society to express their opinion in a democratic way.
Di refers to positive actions of Council but only the Gnetics Symposium is a decision of this Council, the remainder were made by previous Councils, some a long time ago.
I would also remind Di that we are following a legitimate procedure, similar to herself in 2007, but unlike herself we have stopped short at removing all but one of the existing Council and therefore removing legal governance of the Society as shedid. Perhaps if the Chairman at the time had been from Kent she would have been less aggressive.
Much of this problem eminates from another proposed resolution to publish minutes of Council meetings. This has already received the neccessary support from 5 o/o of the membership and would have been on the agenda for decision at the postponed October AGM and will now be carried forward to the January AGM.
So if you have not yet expressed an opinion on the resolution please do so as soon as possible as the deadline expires in the next 24 hours.
If you have not yet seen a copy of the resolution contact Duncan at the e-mail in his message above

Ian

Pennielea wrote:As joint proposer to the resolution to remove members of Council I feel entitled to reply to comments

Di claims we are criticising Council. In my opinion this is a poor choice of words.
We are highlighting a problem which has been ongoing or many months when Council have failed or refused to answer legitimate questions raised by members. All attempts to resolve this situation including refusal by Council to pursue mediation have failed.
This resolution to remove Directors provides allows members of the Society to express their opinion in a democratic way.
Di refers to positive actions of Council but only the Gnetics Symposium is a decision of this Council, the remainder were made by previous Councils, some a long time ago.
I would also remind Di that we are following a legitimate procedure, similar to herself in 2007, but unlike herself we have stopped short at removing all but one of the existing Council and therefore removing legal governance of the Society as shedid. Perhaps if the Chairman at the time had been from Kent she would have been less aggressive.
Much of this problem eminates from another proposed resolution to publish minutes of Council meetings. This has already received the neccessary support from 5 o/o of the membership and would have been on the agenda for decision at the postponed October AGM and will now be carried forward to the January AGM.
So if you have not yet expressed an opinion on the resolution please do so as soon as possible as the deadline expires in the next 24 hours.
If you have not yet seen a copy of the resolution contact Duncan at the e-mail in his message above

Ian

I wish you luck in pursuing this cause of action in a democratic way. However, I do feel that the membership in general have been baffled in respect of focus on constitutional matters of which the vast majority have no understanding at all and therefore relevance to them.

What the members do see is a secret society and no debate.

There are clearly divisions which have been evident for some time perhaps they are only going to be resolved once and for all if a separate organisation is set up for the direction of commercial beef operations with a leasing option for the rights to use 'the Mark'.
Tin hat on....

Well, what a situation we have here. I so wish I could reply on here as Mark Bowles but I am a member of council and a member of a team with my colleagues. Secret society I hear you say, I don't recognise this statement, council members represent yourselves do they not, ask them questions if you are concerned on any subject. To counter the above arguments, of which I have every right, I will make my email address available and try to answer questions on the above.
Please don't compare this situation to 2007/2008, that would be incorrect.

info@dextercattleforsale.co.uk

With due respect Mark, Council members hands are tied by confidentiality clauses. The non-publication of Minutes means that nothing can be discussed openly and once you vote someone onto Council you have absolutely no idea what they are doing. Is the reduced number of Council members helpful or is there just the point of view of the few like-minded individuals taking priority. When you have a situation where there are certain people that are 'in the know' everyone involved assumes that everyone else is well informed. Indeed, I have been rung up twice in the past week to ask if I could enlighten them as to what was going on??? There is a breakdown in two way communication.

Jac, sadly no one has contacted me before today to get my view, maybe that says something about me,maybe my position, not sure but its certainly not good.

Mark, people don't because they know your hands are tied.