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Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 1:45 pm
by Saffy
Your views please.
Our one and only, Dexter heifer is probably going to calve quite young, so our vet has sensibly advised us to keep her weight down to make an easy calving more likely.
We are keen to choose the best way to start feeding her once/just before she calves to help her milk well, obviously any feed has to be built up gradually but when she does calve we thought it might be worth giving a pound or two of dairy cake for a week or two if she doesn't seem to have alot of milk.
It may be difficult to do much before calving as we are unsure when exactly to expect the calf. We were told it was probably due about May when we bought her but it was difficult for the seller to be sure as they use a bull, we thought she looked closer and had the vet PD her. The vet said January or March. Hhmmm.
If she calves this month - Januaury - she will be 19 months old.
Do Dexter very young heifers generally have enough milk for their calves?
I do remember from a rogue bull getting to our dairy heifers that very young heifers don't always have the quality or quantity of colostrum so I am obtaining some from my neighbour and freezing it but will let/make the calf suck the heifer first.
Also if she does calve as young as say 19 months would it be a good idea to give her a little longer before going to the bull than usual for the second time to allow her to grow and mature, e.g so she would calve a couple of months later next time or in your experience is this gap too long, will she simply run to fat and have trouble calving next time?
She has lost some weight lately so is now getting about a pound of beef nuts split into 3 feeds, going out to plenty of grass for 6 hours a day, mostly for the exercise and a small feed of hay twice a day.
Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 5:06 pm
by Duncan MacIntyre
You want this heifer to be fit but not fat, and if she looks as though she has lost some weight be wary that you are not holding back her growth. You want her to grow as much as possible. Cutting back will have a much more marked effect on her growth than that of the calf - nature will take nutrients off her back if necessary to ensure growth of the calf. This may sound a bit vague but it is difficult to be exact without seeing her and the grass and hay.
I used to feed mine quite a bit of cake and calf them at two or just under, never any bother. Then I changed to feeding no cake and hay only, and did have difficulty with a 21 month heifer in 2005. I should have realised she was not being fed well enough and given her some cake.
If you are any good at condition scoring she should be 2.5 sto 3, certainly not 4 or 5, and if she is too low she will not be growing herself.
A newborn Dexter calf does not really need a huge quantity of milk, you can start feeding more after calving if you think the calf is not getting enough - there shouldn't be any need for the old fashioned "steaming up" type precalving feeding.
Try to be sure of the disease status of where the colostrum has come from, an easy way to introduce infection.
13-14 months before the next calf should be ok.
Duncan
Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 5:59 pm
by Saffy
Thanks Duncan, that is a huge help.
She has only lost a little condition so we have slightly upped her cake and will now gradually up it until she reaches a suitable quantity. May I ask what you found to be the right amount of cake to feed yours?
I would say her condition score has possibly gone down to between 3 and 2.5, its hard to say as she has a slightly high tail head but I don't want it to fall further. However I have been holding her back purposefully until now on my vets advice.
The spare colostrum would come from one of the cows belonging to my tenant. My cattle unfortunately have to come into contact with his to some extent as they are housed next to his youngstock here in the winter so I thought if I were to get it from anywhere it might as well be there. It would only be fed if needed.
Thanks for the advice!
Stephanie
Edited to say having had a close look this evening her condition score wouldn't be less than 3.
Edited By Saffy on 1199744878
Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 8:04 pm
by Sylvia
Unlike Duncan we have never fed concentrates to the Dexters, they have adlib grass in the summer months, adlib hay/haylage during the winter and some of both in the autumn when the goodness starts going out of the grass. The 'beefy' types manage to stay well on this and so do the lighter 'dairy' types. We don't milk our Dexters, but one who lost her calf reared a limo X calf a few years ago also, at present, we have an orphan who is doing very well with the help of his 'aunties'. Generally we put heifers with the bull at around 14 months but if they don't look ready they wait a bit longer. This system, as you all know only too well, has worked for us until we were absolutely over-run with Dexters.
We had a bought in heifer who was born 13.06.03 who calved 21.06.04. She needed a C/S to get the well grown heifer calf out, but she fed her babe and reared her really well by herself. We gave her a year to recover and the mother grew on to a good size as did the babe. They have both calved successfully and uneventfully since.
The high tail head seems to be a feature of Dexters, noticed by people more used to other breeds.
I know how difficult it is but try not to worry, Saffy.
Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 10:00 pm
by Saffy
Thank you Sylvia and we will try not to worry!
I am amazed and delighted to hear that a yearling heifer that had endured a caesarean could feed her calf so well they are tough little things aren't they.
Stephanie
Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 9:27 am
by Sylvia
You may have hit on the real benefit of Dexters, Saffy, they do seem to be 'tough little things'. And it is the simple fact that they haven't been messed about with to give so many more gallons of milk than nature intended or pumped up to provide unnatural amounts of beef that could be the reason.
When we lose one it may seem they are just as vulnerable to all the cow problems as other breeds but in the wider scheme of things I'm not sure this is the case.
Someone will now mention that Dexters are more pampered by their loving owners so you'll have to decide if it is nature or nurture, but I doubt if pampering ever toughened anything up.
Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 1:10 pm
by AlisonKirk
Saffy
I realise everyone has their own management systems - personally, I wouldn't give any extra feed. Dexters have a wonderful ability to utilise all feed better than other breeds. If your heifer gets too fat, the calf may have problems turning prior to birth, resulting in a breech birth. You may even get a calf properly presented...nose/front feet through the pelvis and unable to deliver the rest because he is too big and the pelvis is too small in an under-developed heifer. Your own vet seems to think she is good enough condiition, so I should take heed of his advice.
She will milk well enough to feed her calf without extra feed, providing she has sufficient hay/silage. As Duncan says you don't want her gushing with milk immediately at calving, as 'baby' will only take small amounts initially. After a week or two, they will emerge from their dam's udder with milk all over their faces and growing rapidly.
Time & time again I hear Dexters owners talking about large calves ('bigger is better') ... it usually transpires concentrates are being fed and their have been some losses during calving.
Our Dexters are not huge when born, but they deliver 99.9% of the time without assistance, get up quickly & suckle. Cows are happy and heifers are pleased to have a calf and not frightened of it because of all the trauma caused by diffiicult calvings.
Generally we have no problems, but do have the occasional blip, that's just the nature of livestock farming.
I hope you heifer calves with no problems.
Best Wishes
Alison Kirk
Boram Dexters
Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 1:28 pm
by AlisonKirk
Saffy - If you are concerned about your heifer, it would be better to wait until she has calved to feed her the concentrates ..... you will have time to get her used to them, because as I said in my previous posting, calves do not need a huge intake of milk initially.
Alison Kirk
Boram Dexters
Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 7:12 pm
by Jo Kemp
Hi Saffy - best wishes for the calving
I never feed beforehand - though have given a token simply to ensure a desire for the bucket! they have good quality haylage.
I do give a molassed lick though - high mag. a heifer shouldn't need a calcium boost as that is usually an older cow problem.
A nice soft, deep straw bed and gentle rubs around the tail head ... they love it
Jo