Red heads

oliver1921 · Post by **oliver1921** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 1:44 pm

We have a mixture of red and black cattle (oh - and one dun). we never have any problems handling the black ones, can never control the red ones and the dun just can't be bothered to do anything other than eat - and will come in his own time but causes no bother. i know that in theory there should be no difference but this seems to be certainly the case with ours. (The bull is the same for all of them - red and docile - and the mums all black)

One of my sons is a red head and the other is dark - it is exactly the same with them!

Is this a common trait or are my cattle just weird

Broomcroft · Post by **Broomcroft** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 4:33 pm

I haven't detected much difference with my reds. I've got about 20% reds and the rest nearly all black. But the same is said of horses about red mares. I've got a red mare and she nearly had my fingers off once. No comment on humans, because for all I know, you're all redheads!

Sylvia · Post by **Sylvia** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 6:47 pm

Just thank your lucky stars there are no blonde Dexters.

Martin · Post by **Martin** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 8:54 pm

Especially blonde ones from Essex!

welshdexterboy · Post by **welshdexterboy** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 10:19 pm

What about Blonde Aquataines? are they typical blondes:D

Liz D · Post by **Liz D** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 10:43 pm

Ok now you've done it Rob! Exactly what is a 'typical' blond? (Open that mouth wide

) Liz, the Canadian blond.

welshdexterboy · Post by **welshdexterboy** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 10:53 pm

OK Liz----Well they are usually light brown/ mousy in colour, well muscled and docile. Have I managed to wriggle out of it yet????

Minnie · Post by **Minnie** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 3:22 am

Okey dokey I was a redhead till turning white... no comments on the white ???

I wasn't difficult to control when young, a bit headstrong possibly but gave no trouble... or that's my story... :p

Hmmm look at Prince Harry...

:D
Vicki

Kirk- Cascade Herd US · Wed Dec 05, 2007 7:55 am

Here is a possible explanation:

Think of how all animals begin as a single fertilized egg, then that single cell divides into 2, then 4, then 8, then 16, etc....... At first, all the cells (stem cells) are identical. Then at some point, the cells start to differentiate and migrate to their positions (heart cells to the heart area, brain cells to the brain area, etc.). Well, the pigment cells actually start along the neural crest (where the new brain cells and spinal cord cells also start). Then, these pigment cells migrate out across the surface of the body. The cells that create the color-producing melanins are very closely related to the nervous system cells. It is possible (and has been theorized by serious scientists) that the coding for color, can affect the development of the nervous system cells in minor ways.

It has been theorized that the coding for red pigment (phaeomelanin), can make an animal more nervous and uppity. Now, that said, if this is true, the nervous and uppity red animals may actually have very nice calm behavior genetics, but the red pigment effect is masking that genetic calmness. So, under this not quite proven theory, a calm red animal must have extra super calm behavior genes in order to counter the red pigment effect. Also, one must consider that the original wild cattle were all red (wild-type red, not true red), while black was a recent mutation. It could be that the black mutation somewhat interferes with the normal, not-so-calm nature of the animals that was needed for survival, so under this theory, it's really the blacks that have the "defective" mutated behavior of being extra calm.

If anyone wants to read more about this, I can probably dig up a few links to post.

Kirk

www.cascademeadowsfarm.com

PS. I have a really nice calm true-red polled bull for sale. He must have extra calm behavioral genes because he's a pussycat.

wagra dexters · Post by **wagra dexters** » Wed Dec 05, 2007 11:27 am

Kirk, a friend theorised that it could be possible for a ventral stripe to be lack of colour rather than a white line, as this is presumably where colour meets up with itself, and may possibly sometimes be incomplete. Is there any evidence anywhere that this could be so, and if so, how would it be differentiated from inherited white?
Margaret.

Edited By wagra dexters on 1196850604

Kirk- Cascade Herd US · Wed Dec 05, 2007 1:15 pm

wagra dexters wrote:Kirk, a friend theorised that it could be possible for a ventral stripe to be lack of colour rather than a white line, as this is presumably where colour meets up with itself, and may possibly sometimes be incomplete. Is there any evidence anywhere that this could be so, and if so, how would it be differentiated from inherited white?
Margaret.

In mammals, there are two pigment options, eumelanin (black/brown) and phaeomelanin (red/yellow/orange). White is always simply the total lack of melanin. Various genetics and conditions cause white markings. Since the cells that create the melanin start at the neural crest (essentially, the dorsal line along the top of the head and along the back) and then migrate across the body to meet at the ventral line (belly), if something interferes with this process, those cells may not make it all of the way in order to meet at the center of the belly by some certain important point in fetal development and so you get white markings down there. Some genetic versions of this slowing of pigment cell migration also result in white stockings and/or a white nose and chest in some breeds/species.

The various forms of regular white spotting work by shutting off the pigment production in certain areas of the body, so all forms of white are the lack of pigment. There are spotting genes that create the various white spotting patterns, like the famous Hereford spotting gene, but the ventral white markings along the belly in many otherwise solid colored animals may not be caused by the regular spotting genes and instead may be caused by genes (or conditions) that slow the migration of the pigment producing cells.

Kirk

wagra dexters · Post by **wagra dexters** » Thu Dec 06, 2007 11:19 am

Kirk, thank you for your reply.

Margaret.

welshdexterboy · Post by **welshdexterboy** » Fri Dec 07, 2007 12:04 am

Minnie isn't white a very light blonde? As for your description of you in your recent youth sounds very dexter like to me.???